Transcript 0:01 It's the Dose of Fat, show number 129 for Friday, October 20th, 2017. Introducing the Dose of Fat, I'm Spinner with Leia Anne Gomez. Greetings, earthlings. [laughs] Uh, over there is our, uh, cohost, Leia, 0:20 Leia Schneeberger. Hi, everyone. Happy to be back and fat. Here's where I'm not gonna reintroduce Spinner 'cause he already introduced himself. I introduced myself. 0:32 But there's Spinner in there right next to Leia over there, uh, in the other room. Mm-hmm. I'm in the control room. Can you hear me now? And, uh, yeah, we had a little audio issues. 0:42 [laughs] We have, we have a lot of new fancy toys here at Dose of Fat. Put this microphone in my mouth. I promise you these toys work. [laughs] That's right. We now have a shock collar on Spinner- Yeah... 0:51 if he gets too far away from the mic. And Leia's got the button. [laughs] That's... [laughs] The test- Get back over here. [laughs] That's good... the testing of that system was very interesting, Leia. 1:01 [laughs] I enjoyed that just a little bit too much. Yeah, you did. So this week's show is brought to you by the Surly Edna, not my great Aunt Edna. 1:13 And, uh, the Surly Edna is 4.3 inches, which is, uh, nestled right there between the 4.0 and 4.8. It'll fit, uh, just right. And, uh, it's an all-conditions tire. It's kinda knobby. 1:31 And i- if you want, you can get them right now, or you can get more information about that at surlybikes.com. There was supposed to be a joke in there somewhere, wasn't there? [laughs] I was waiting for it. 1:50 The gap? [laughs] Leia's our gap expert. Can you tell us about the gap? [laughs] Would that be the gap in between tire sizes? Exactly. [laughs] The perfect, velvety smooth 4.3. 2:03 So you can learn all about that tire at surlybikes.com, along with all kinds of other new stuffs that, uh, that has hit their shelves of late. All right. 2:12 All right, so, uh, what's, uh, what's new on the show, silent Spinney? [laughs] First off, I would like to congratulate you on your second Wars championship. Hey, yeah, back to back. Back to back. What do you know? 2:27 And they pay you for that. 1,500 bills. So that's 500 for you, 500 for Gomez [laughs], 500 for me. Is that how it is? I owe it all to you guys. Yeah, it's- Coulda done it- Ev- I'm like your lucky charm now... 2:40 if it wasn't for The Viking and my thoughts. Oh, we're gonna talk about that later. [laughs] [laughs] All right, so congratulations. And I can't believe that I saw that you got a nice plaque. 2:55 But, you know, don't you think that you should, now that you're two-time, you should start throwing your weight around a little bit and say, "Guys, I'm, uh, I'm thinking a crown would be in order." 3:05 Yeah, where's my crown? Belt buckle, something, you know, whatever, whatever you want it to be. I think that, uh, you, we're very close to being the, uh, the, the Wars Leia Schneeberger Cup. I don't know, man. 3:18 I'm, I kinda like dollar bills, y'all. [laughs] You can't spend a crown? What can I say? [laughs] I have an idea. I'm gonna produce one. I want a check so big it won't fit inside the Cadillac. Mm-hmm. 3:32 We gotta get a video of me trying to go to the bank and showing it to them. [laughs] Showing that in there. That would be- Did you sign the back? [laughs] So what else is on the show, Spinner? 3:42 Oh, we're gonna start off with the event of the week, the Huge Ass Fat Bike series, and then the Margie Gesick, Jesick- We're gonna guess that it's Gesick. We're gonna guess Gesick? 3:52 'Cause that's what, that's what Leia told us it was. Guess it's making people sick. [laughs] Man, makes people sick. We'll talk about- There's guys puking on the side of that course. Yeah. Whoo. It was hot, I heard. 4:03 Uh, we welcome our special guest, Scott Robinson of Inte- Integration Body Works. Uh, we're gonna talk about training and recovery tips. And, uh, Leia, you subscribe to these training and recovery tips? 4:17 Absolutely necessary- There we go... for survival. Uh, we go to Fat Bike Radio News Desk in New York City, and in our special segment, we ask the question, can a Viking conquer an ice queen? That's... [laughs] Okay. 4:31 The other, the other thing- [laughs]... 4:32 that, that we have to put in there is we're actually, in the news segment, going to go live, a live feed to, uh, Surly, intergalactic Surly headquarters for a, a conversation with Andy Skoglund, the Skogs. Yeah. 4:46 What- And what about Emilia?... crack engineer. Oh, yeah, and what about Emilia? And we're gonna call Emilia, right? Who's, we just never knew 'cause she's like Batgirl. 4:54 You never know if you can get her on the bat phone or not. Well, we're gonna try here. We're gonna try. She might be here. Anyways, okay. So you want me to say that, or was that good? No. I, that's fine. Okay. 5:05 I think that, I think that that covers everything that's on the show, so we should probably go right into the events of the week. Yeah, let's jump right in. [laughs] And this is where Leia's gonna talk a lot. 5:16 [laughs] This is where I- Weird... this is my part, yeah. I don't know if we can handle it. [laughs] We're not used to that. [laughs] All right. Yeah. 5:23 [laughs] The Margie Gesick, it's 100-mile race in Marquette, Michigan, in the mountains. It's got rocks, roots, punchy climbs, and oh, man, I wanna say there's 12,000 feet of climbing. 5:38 And- There's hi- hike-a-bike, right? There's quite a bit of hike-a-bike, and sometimes you're hiking your bike down 'cause you're so gassed from trying to get up these hills. Hi, Chihuahua. 5:48 Uh, yep, and then they're pretty squirrely on the way down, some of them. Uh, but the course is, is amazing. 5:54 I mean, I, I went out there, uh, signed up for the 50 last minute just 'cause I wanted to go ride the trails, and they were unbelievableJust, just a ton of fun. Uh, after the race they had beer, a DJ. 6:07 Oh, shit, I'm talking about Huge Ass right now. [laughs] Yeah, you're on the wrong show. [laughs] The wrong race. I'm like, no, there's none of that in the Margie. This is- Dude, the Margie is just pure torture. 6:20 Yeah, you said that you were out there- Fun... out there in the middle of the woods- Oh my God... 6:24 screaming for help I'm thinking there's more aid stations, so I bypass one of them and the next thing I know I'm out there for an hour and a half with no water. It's 90 degrees. 6:33 I'm climbing thousands of feet, and I'm dying, and I'm like screaming at the top of my lungs, "Is there anybody out there?" [laughs] Like, "Feed me." Everything's cramping up. I'm locked up. I don't know what to do. 6:45 There's no one in front of me. There's no one in be- there's nobody around. I'm in the middle of nowhere. I'm in the middle of the mountains. And- Stuck at the top of the hill... 6:52 and that's when I said, "Well, did, did, did you ever think of just stopping and-" [laughs] For someone to catch you. [laughs] And you were like, "No, idiot." She's like, "Help me!" S- and the guy's like, "Slow down." 7:05 [laughs] Yeah. I don't- "You're riding away from me. I have water right here. Stop." [laughs] I don't understand. [laughs] Stop? I don't... [laughs] I can- I did not think of that. It didn't even pop in your head. 7:17 That's awful. You're just like, "I have to suffer." [laughs] I just gotta keep... I'm like crying. I'm in tears. Everything's cramping up, locking up. Oh my gosh. What were you riding? What bike? Uh, my Niner. Niner? 7:27 Yep, yep. The RDO. Full suspension was wonderful for that one, so it's a, it's a great course. Uh, really hard. Jeremiah Bishop came in and won, and said it's the hardest endurance race he's ever done. 7:40 So now, get this, in one day they've already sold out the registrations for next year- I saw that... 'cause all these hot shots wanna come in and show their stuff. Everybody's... What are the- is it Blame Danny? 7:49 Is that the video? Yeah. Blame Danny, blame Todd, and they have these little signs all over the course [laughs] after- Danny put this climb in. Big old climb. It's like- No... Blame Danny. It's great. 7:59 [laughs] Do you have somebody to swear at? Swear a little. You'll feel better. 60% of the field. Is there anybody out there? 60% of the field DNF'd on that race. Yep. Mm-hmm. 60? That, that- Yeah... 8:11 I thought it was more than that. I thought it was higher, but... Well, and did you end up finishing, or did you cramp up, or did- No, I, uh, at about mile 35, I was already four hours in, 8:23 and I'm thinking, "I don't wanna be on my bike for another three hours." [laughs] I just don't wanna do it. So no, I bailed, and then I had to text the race director, hashtag quitter. Oh. Oh. Oh my God. Isn't that great? 8:37 That's in the instructions? That's what you're supposed to do? Yeah, that's- I like that... in the instructions on your bike. [laughs] Oh, that's, that's mean. Yeah. Oh, and then this Todd guy- So did you just pass out? 8:47 This Todd guy, he's relentless now. He's been giving me the business ever since. [laughs] So next year, are you gonna do it? Are you gonna do it next year? I haven't registered, but- Oh, yeah, it's full now, so... 8:56 I'll bet I, I bet I might be able to- This sounds like the same crew-... con my way in... that does the Polar Roll. They- It is. The 906 guys. Got it. Yep. Okay. 9:04 That, I recognize the, the taunting the racers- [laughs] Yes, yes... portion of the program. And the Polar Roll is a 40-miler in the snow, the fat bikes. Or, or 15 if you're, you know. [laughs] If you're- [laughs]... 9:16 if you're a gentle rose petal like Gomez. [laughs] Exactly. A delicate flower. You know, you're just out there for funskis. I can't wait to do that race. A- anything in Marquette is wonderful. 9:28 That, in the snow, in the summer, doesn't matter. They got some of the best trails I've ever been on. Absolutely. Well, should we try and ring up Amelia about the Huge Ass Series? Yeah, about the Huge Ass Series. 9:41 All right. I'm going to press the button. The Huge Ass Series is a local series that, uh, is now the new sponsor of Fat Bike Radio News Desk. 9:53 And, uh, we were gonna have the commissioner of the Huge Ass Fat Bike Race Series, uh, Amelia Kegel, on the, on the show. 10:01 But instead of Amelia, we actually have the winner of the first, well, last year's point series and this year's first race, uh, Leah Schnepfer. Yeah. Huge Ass is already underway. 10:15 Uh, they have eight races throughout the winter. Uh, you know, places like Minooka, the Alpha Trails, John Muir, Grand Geneva, so all south- southeastern Wisconsin for the most part. Right. 10:29 And, uh, they have races for, uh, they have an elite division as well as a citizen division, so you can do about 20 miles or the 10-mile option. And this is the one where they have beer shortcuts- [laughs]... 10:44 so you chug a beer and then you can cut some of the course off. In between laps, you have to hammer schlagin. Right. 10:50 So they got these nails and this big old piece of lumber, and you gotta nail those in, so people actually practice. Do you have a special race hammer? Uh, they provide hammers. Ooh. 11:00 But this first race I won a hammer, so I will have that- You won it? Oh... for the rest of them. I would think like a special engraved tat- It is... titanium hammer. [laughs] Oh, yeah... 11:11 you know, would be the, would be the shizzy. You have to carry it then? Shiznizzy. You carry it and ride behind? Yeah, I put it right on my back and then hammer it in, and off I go. Yeah? Without stopping? Yeah. 11:21 [laughs] I'm that good. I'm that good. I didn't know you knew how to stop. I didn't know how that worked. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. We didn't know if we, you, you, yeah, you actually have to stop sometimes. 11:29 [laughs] She does, she just falls over sometimes. [laughs] If I crash, that's about, that's what stops me. [laughs] I saw. Yeah. Yeah, I did see- You're going through a lot of helmets this summer, I see. I- [laughs] Oh. 11:37 I did see an awkward pic of- Oh... a picture of you like splayed out awkwardly- Oh, God... on the ground, dude. [laughs] Yeah. [laughs] Just covered in it. Close up of your cracked helmet. Rolling in pain in the dirt. 11:48 [laughs] Yikes. No, but the Huge Ass Series is the first time I'd ever hopped on a fat bike. Oh. Oh, yeah? Two years ago, mm-hmm. Wow. And that was it. It's been love ever since? Yeah. Fat bike love. 12:01 I, I contacted them and said, "How can we work together?" Because they really get it. They get the fun part. They get the race part. 12:11 Uh, it's kind, maybe it's a weird thing that is exclusive to Wisconsin fat bike racing, but our races tend to be-A lot of fun. So- Yeah, it's more about the fun. 12:25 I mean, you get bonus points for dressing in flannel, bringing or a, uh, a c- a costume. Uh, there's points for ugly sweaters. Mm. Mm. 12:34 And the bonus points are actually more valuable than winning the, the points you get from winning the race. [laughs] I like that. I like that. All right. Yeah. It's supportive. So it's good. 12:43 They got a DJ every time, bonfires, raffles. It, it's just a big, it's a big party. Everyone goes for the party, no doubt. Oh, cool. Cool. Well, that was our Event of the Week segment. 12:56 We're gonna take a little break, and when we come back, we're going to talk to Scott Roberson from the Integration Body Works. And, uh, what is it? Uh, compassionate touching? 13:06 [chuckles] I think you said compassionate touching, yes. Fantastic. Mm-hmm. That's what we're back with after this. [laughs] [upbeat music] So I heard you need a fat bike, come to Zion Cyclery in Zion, Illinois. 13:21 We have all brands: Trek, Borealis, Salsa, Felt, Surly, and more. Yo, we have all the cold weather gears by 45NRTH and Bontrager. Keep those fingers and toes nice and toasty. We fix bikes also. 13:38 So you have any problem, brakes, gears, suspension, we have the best mechanics in town. So yeah, visit us at zioncyclery.com. Hey, welcome back to the show. 13:56 We're going to have a new segment, and this one's called Leia's Crash Repair. [mimicking crashing] I've only busted two helmets this summer. 14:07 [snorting] [laughs] But that's okay 'cause I, uh, I work with Scott Robinson of Integration Body Work, and, uh, he's the one that keeps me out of the pain cave after all of my hard workouts, and sometimes has to put my neck back together after I ram my face into the dirt. 14:26 Again. So thank you for that. [laughs] Yeah. Well, let's, and let's give credit where credit's due. Megan Sullivan is who you usually see, so let's, let's make sure we- Oh, yeah. Yeah... we give her a shout-out. 14:35 She's, she's very strong. I, I don't know what I would do without Megan. I go and see her at least once a month to keep this body going. 14:45 So, uh, so Scott, as the owner of Integration Body Work, what are some of your favorite ways to deal with, uh, post-wo- workout soreness? Sure. 14:55 So let's talk about the really e- maybe not easy stuff, but the stuff that we know for sure totally works. 15:00 Uh, number one on the list is absolutely sleep, and it sounds obvious, but sleep is by far, uh, the best way to recover from all of the things you're doing to yourself, whether it's training, crash, life. 15:12 Um, and how much sleep seems to be dependent on who you are. It's probably not five hours. It's also probably not six hours. It's probably more like si- eight and seven, eight, nine, something like that. 15:24 You have to figure that out on your own. But, uh, sleep is the, is the place that I would start. Um- I am killing, killing the sleep game then. [laughs] Yeah, totally. So I... 15:32 Could I take that to my boss, so I can get afternoon naps? [laughs] Uh, that's up to you. [laughs] Uh- My massage therapist says I need this one-hour nap at three o'clock and every afternoon. Absolutely. 15:46 Yeah, you can put, uh, you can put Megan's name in on that for sure. Give me a written, a written note. Yeah, absolutely. [laughs] Uh, yeah. So number two is food, right? 15:53 Getting enough food in you, especially right after your... In this case, right after your ride is done. Um, 15:59 uh, obviously we know carbohydrate is important both for, uh, immediately after, uh, post-exercise, but also to continue the recovery process. You need plenty of protein. 16:09 Hmm, probably talking probably about a gram per pound of body weight. Um, talk to your nutritionist about that, but that's, uh, that's, that's important. It's not just a plate of pasta, right? 16:19 You need a couple of meatballs to go with it. Um, number three is just relaxation, right? 16:26 Taking the stress out of your life, whether that's, you know, uh, reacting better to how things are going at the office or, um, you know, having fun with, you know, like going to see a movie, having f- you know, relaxing activities, things like that. 16:40 These are really, like obvious things that are, aren't super sexy. It's not a like, oh, do this one thing with the foam roller or do like a contrast shower, which kind of works some of the time. 16:48 Um, these things for sure have evidence behind them, you know, tons of, you know, stacks and stacks of research. Uh- But where does the massage fit in? I'm getting to there. Hang on. Hang on. 16:57 Last one that we know for sure works is, uh, what the literature calls compassionate touching, which sounds both what... Exactly like you think it is. [laughs] 'Cause I'm going somewhere in my head. 17:06 But it also, but it also extends to just, like snuggle time. It extends to a back rub from, uh... I guess, you, it looks like you got a ring, so it extends to a back rub from your, uh, fiance. Um- Mr. and/or Ms. Right. 17:19 Yeah, exactly. Mm-hmm. Totally. Um, or, you know, and things like a super heavy duty, uh, relaxation massage. 17:27 You know, you went to, you go to Hawaii and you get the hot stone with, you know, after the hot tub, and you feel like you got, uh, hit by a truck of relaxation. Those all work for sure. 17:37 Now, what do we do, I think is the question you're really asking me. Um, the thing that we do that's d- that's a little bit different from more traditional massage is the focus on, 17:47 uh, I guess we call this, depends on how you wanna talk about it, myofascial release, things like that, that are, uh, re- heavi- um, very strong, uh, neurologic stimulators. 17:59 So the post-workout soreness that you typically f- feel after a race, after a really hard training session produces acute, uh, muscular soreness, right? 18:09 And it's literally you broke up, you destroyed a bunch of the muscle cells. There's inflammation. That's A, painful all by itself, and B, it screws up how your, how your muscles fire. M- messes with your motor patterns. 18:19 The kind of work that Megan and I do, uh, improves, uh, sort of restores normal movement patterns so that you not only move better, but you actually feel like you're moving better, so that those guarding responses of limited range of motion, things like that go away, uh, and you're able to get back to training, uh, in a more, or sort of at your normal, normal hard level. 18:38 Oh, the last one's, uh, since this is an endurance crew, uh, light spinning, right? Just going out for an easy spin the day after. It's sort of, you know, it's... 18:46 And it's not so much that you're flushing lactic acid, anything like that. It's just the, uh-Extra blood flow and metabolite stuff helps, um, clear and rep- do- and repair. 18:56 And, uh, [clears throat] a group ride isn't always the best- Right... choice of doing a recovery. Depend- For a recovery ride. [laughs] Depends on, depends on what your group is, right? Right. 19:06 It would, would not- For every guy you add. [laughs] Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Also add another mile per hour. [laughs] Exactly. [laughs] Yep, okay. So what are some areas that the cyclist should focus on? Yeah. 19:21 So I, I think in ter- you're, you're asking like, like in the day-to-day taking care of themselves? Yeah. What they should do at home. Yeah. Yeah. What you should do at home. 19:27 So some really easy, um, like pin and stretch, foam rolling on the quads, uh, glutes, uh, low back. All the places that you feel tight and sore respond really well to some easy, just some easy rolling. 19:40 And better than just like rolling back and forth and kind of mindlessly doing it, actually, um, holding still, 19:47 uh, and then actually using the muscle back and forth over the foam roller is a really effective way to, um, sort of, again, restore those movement patterns in a, in a, in a more powerful way. Um, 19:58 but places to do that, so yeah. So that's all quads, q- glutes, low back. 20:02 But places also that you don't use very much, 'cause you tend to get into the shape of your bike, and being on your bike is very similar to the shape of sitting in your chair, which is similar to the shape of being in your car. 20:12 So doing some work to stretch out your hip flexors, right, uh, the long quads, those deep f- flexors like the psoas and the iliacus. 20:19 Um, doing some w- just doing some work to get your, uh, improve your ability to look up. 20:24 So you can kind of hang your head off the back of the couch, something like that, so that you can, you know, get used to not just looking down or straight ahead, but also looking up. 20:33 Um, getting your arms overhead, just hanging from a pull-up bar if you've got one in your house or ha- grabbing, I don't know. Leia, can you grab the top of a door? I'm too short for that. Get a pull-up bar- [laughs]... 20:42 and put it in your house and hang from that. [laughs] Yeah, that works pr- I can't reach the top of the door... that works, works pretty well. Um, right. 20:48 Just get, get your arms overhead because you spend all that time pushing your bike down and away from you. Being able to hang from something helps, uh, restore normal shoulder function. 20:56 Scott, just, Scott, just tempting fate there by, uh, calling Leia short. I didn't call her short. [laughs] I was asking a question. [laughs] I let her do that herself. Within, within striking distance, too. 21:08 We're all, we're, you know, we've done one show, and we're, we're very afraid of Leia. Oh, he knows how to bring the pain, too. [laughs] Don't- Oh, oh. [laughs] So- Don't let him fool you. 21:17 [laughs] Is there a particular school of massage or technique or, or, uh, like applied kinesiology or? [laughs] Sure. Yeah. 21:28 So massage is definitely an area where we, we suffer from an overabundance of overlapping like brand names. Mm-hmm. Um, I think the school of thought that I come from is something called structural integration. 21:38 If you've heard of Rolfing or something like that, it's very similar. 21:41 Um, but I'm sort of, I've sort of moved a little bit away from that and more down like Gray Cook's Functional Movement Screen, Selective Functional Movement Assessment sort of area. Um, but yeah. That's the kind of... 21:52 That's, that like structurally oriented, get balance back to the body, make sure things move well, move consistently, move symmetrically. How do you feel about, uh, the practice of yoga? 22:02 It's great, as long as you're doing it well. Sure. Yeah. [laughs] Yeah. I understand there's some dangers involved. Yeah. And it's more, it's more danger- as, as per usual, right? 22:11 It's more dangerous for men than for women typically 'cause we're strong enough to get ourselves into shapes our bodies can't really be in or shouldn't be in. But yeah. All right. 22:21 Before we get too dirty, we should probably say goodbye to you, Scott. [laughs] Yeah. Thanks for coming in, Scott. I appreciate that. You bet. Glad to be here. Thanks for having me. 22:34 Do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do. This fa- uh, Fat Bike Radio news desk and stuff. This is your Fat Bike Radio news desk. I'm Leia here at Fat Bike Radio world headquarters in Madison, Wisconsin. 22:46 Our lead story is na, na, na, na, na, na, na, and comes from our roving reporter, River Hotammentango. [laughs] That's Hottementeneho, Leia. Oh, really? [laughs] Is that what that is? I knew you'd get it. 23:01 'Cause that looks like hot mama and me tangoed- [laughs]... Jojo. It is. Well, this is, uh, River Hottementeneho. 23:11 [laughs] And I have a story about CABDA, the Chicago Area Bicycle Dealer Areas A- Association Show, something. CABDA. 23:20 CABDA, it goes way back when I used to work at a bike shop back in the last century, and, uh, was quite a show back then, and it's been growing for the last few years. 23:31 So large, in fact, that they have to move to, to Schaumburg, to 100,000 square foot convention center in Schaumburg, the center of the universe, down there near Chicago. And, uh, it's mostly for industry. 23:47 So this is interesting because this year, Interbike really kind of fell apart and was tiny, was not well attended. Not a lot of bike companies went there. So we see other shows starting to 24:04 re-energize and pop up. So we're gonna go cover this. Spinner and I are gonna go cover this. Yes. So, you know, press passes, limousines. Hotel, wine, champagne. [laughs] We doing the works. 24:18 We can go to the Indian casino in Rosemont. [laughs] We can wear tuxedos in there? Oh, tuxedos. [laughs] Good idea. We kinda look like we know what we're doing. Well, what the hell? You have a tuxedo? 24:29 [laughs] Leia, don't, aren't you gonna be- There is a third in the room. [laughs] Oh, we have a third wheel. You want, you wanna come with? Oh my gosh. [laughs] Fine. 24:42 What does a girl gotta do to get an invite around here? See, this is our- I'm taking my... I'm getting out of here, and I'm taking my studio with me. Oh, no. Leave your check. [laughs] Oh, no. We, we were gonna... 24:54 We're saving the surprise for you later. Now we just ruined it. But, you know- Mm-hmm... you get to come with, too. You have to wear- It's, it's only if there's compassionate touching. 25:03 [laughs]In a crowded expo center [laughing] [laughs] There's little else that goes on. So, uh, yeah, it's in Schaumburg, and, uh, you know, it, it's gonna be a cool time. 25:17 There's gonna be, like, bikes and stuff, so check that out. I like bikes. And, uh, the other thing that, uh- What is it? Did you say what it stands for? The Chicago Area Bicycle Dealer Association. Okay. 25:33 And, uh, I went last year, and it was an up-and-coming show. It was down at the Pheasant Run Resort. And, um, so they're, they're making it bigger. 25:44 This is where years ago, the first time I ever met Greg Herbold was at CABDA. Oh, yeah? He was, uh, working for Miata at the time. Huh. So-- Or riding for Miata. [laughs] I hate to say this. 26:00 Is this the same day as Frostbike? [laughs] I'm not even kidding. It's close. It actually, it actually could be the same day as Frostbike. Okay. So Dave, if you're out there listening, um, yeah. Beat you to it. 26:11 He was gonna say that. Yeah. Yeah. I'm sure. So now we actually need to call Mr. Andy, uh, Skoglund from Surly, and we're going to have a little round table discussion about progressive geometry in mountain bikes. Yeah. 26:28 So stand by for that. So we've invited Andy Skoglund from Surly Bikes on the radio program to talk about really 26:40 what I see as a, a, uh, revolutionary change in Surly Bikes and its progressive geometry on their tried and true bikes. And Andy has agreed to come and, uh, talk to us about that. 26:54 So, uh, I know that s- that, uh, Spinner is currently testing a new Krampus which has the progressive geometry, and, well, Spinner and I are owners of the, uh, green, the original Krampus. 27:11 The original Krampus, yeah. So, uh- Yeah, and I guess what I would just like to say about that, so a-and we'll hear your explanation, but, uh, I really like my original Krampus. I-- It's my go-to mountain bike. 27:24 I ride it all the time. I can definitely tell that this bike rides differently, and the geometry's differently. So d- geometry is different. So, um, yeah, let's hear, uh, progressive geometry. 27:35 [laughs] So what did you do to change it? I appreciate the introduction. Yeah. Um, so the, the new Krampus and the old Krampus, um, in terms of geometry really aren't that different. 27:46 Um, I don't doubt that they feel different, but really, um, the head tube angle's a half a degree slacker, which isn't much. I doubt many people could feel that. 27:56 The chain stay length, the rear center is, you know, I think it's about fifteen to twenty mil shorter, which that can be felt. Um, 28:05 but it also has different build kit, and it has different tubes and, uh, some other changes, so it definitely has progressed as a bike. Um, and it, it's changed for the better for some and for the worse for others. 28:20 There's no doubt about that. Um- It really has a lot to do with riding style, too, the progression of riders' abilities and the types of things that they ride, right? 28:33 I think so, and I think that more than, more than like a-- I, uh, the-- Progression is a word for, it, it stands for progress, and I'm not sure if we're going, we're marching down progress or if we're just, um, making different things for different people. 28:49 And, um, as, as we talk about mountain bikes and progressive geometry, I think that lends to some sort of meritocracy of, like, you're a more advanced rider, so you can use more advanced geometry. 29:01 And I tend to lean a little bit more towards preference and riding style and opinion- Mm-hmm... than, than, than actual progression. Um, 29:12 so, uh, to, to the point of progressive geometry as it's understood or as I understood is that, like, uh, mountain bike trails are changing. People are coming from different backgrounds. 29:22 People are coming from BMX and downhill and motocross and every other thing, and they are, they are riding different trails, and bikes are, bikes are, are catering to that opinion. 29:38 Um, there's people who come from road bikes and have been riding a really long time and w-want a bike to feel a certain way, and you're trying to make bikes for them, too. Um, 29:48 I think in terms of geometry, what's really, uh, what I'm really sensitive to is front to back balance. 29:56 Um, so side to side you kind of take care of yourself no matter what bike you're on, but front to back is a harder thing. 30:02 And if you're, you know, if you're riding a trail where you're trying to stay balanced front to back if you're jumping or manualing, you cannot just put weight on the front tire all the time. 30:13 Um, a bike that is easier to unload the front, unload the rear, uh, works really good for you or if you want to do that. Um, and that isn't always because you're shredding the gnar. 30:28 Sometimes that's, you're in a, you're riding a fat bike and there's no traction, and if you weight the front end, it just pushes. Oh, yeah. And so, yeah. 30:36 So, so sometimes it's just there's no traction, and sometimes you're turning a corner really, really hard and you're using all the traction you have. 30:44 Um, and which point, um, I would say mountain bikes from five to ten years ago put a lot of emphasis on front wheel traction and front wheel weight and long, longer stems, steeper-- Your, your f- your front center was shorter, and it was more underneath you, and it handled more like a road bike. 31:01 But when you needed to unload that front end, it was really hard to do. 31:04 Um, and so in my mind, the, the-The blanket statement of progressive geometry is that of, of trying to get the balance of weight and traction per wheel a little bit more balanced. 31:16 That's, that's my definition of like newer geometry. 31:20 So one of the things that you had shared last time that we talked about this was, uh, you felt that the new Krampus, you steer more with your hips than your hands, and the older Krampus- Mm-hmm... 31:32 you steered more with your hands than your hips. Mm. Uh, can you maybe elaborate on that? Or I, I, I- Yeah. Sure. I, I think I can, you know, and that, and that's true, and that's... 31:45 I'm guilty of that being more my riding style of steering with my hips than my hands, which is, you know, leaning the bike as opposed to turning it with your, with the front wheel. Mm-hmm. And that also comes from 31:58 generally riding with not much weight on the front wheel, and that's a personal preference, and that's again, is gonna-- to some people that-- a bike feels dead. Um, but to some people it feels really good. 32:11 And I think that, um, again, taking merit or speed out of the equation, some trails are just really fast and some are really slow, and it's fun. It's fun to be a little out of control. 32:25 And so a really stable bike on a really, um, slow trail can feel really dead. 32:31 Um, whereas a really fast handling, really, I won't say twitchy, but really responsive bike can just be out of control on a really fast trail, but make a really slow trail really exciting. 32:43 And, um, so that's, that's where I'm coming back to what works best for you or works best for where you ride, as opposed to, "Well, I'm hearing about this progressive geometry. 32:53 Maybe, maybe it's time for me to step it up," you know? Um, because, you know, if you think about BMX bikes, they're really steep head tube angles and, you know, like the... 33:03 It, it's not a literal translation into rad versus not rad or boring and not boring. It's just like what works for you. 33:10 And so some people steer with their hips and some people steer with their hands, and I know people that ride faster than me that steer with their hands, and they hate [chuckles] they hate slack head tube angles. 33:20 And, you know, I know people that are slower than, slower than me and love slacker head tube angles, so it really comes down to preference. Um, 33:28 and in terms of the new bike, that comes from, like I said, the shorter chainstays, a little bit longer top tubes. Um, so what you're doing is even though the head tube angle is only a half a degree slacker, 33:41 the wheels are shifting. If you, if you keep your butt in the same spot, both wheels shift forward and you're, you're further back on the bike. Well, there's, there's the very clear picture of, of- [laughs]... 33:53 what, what you've done there. Yeah. And that's, that's kind of what 33:59 demystifying all of that, the word geometry and progressive geometry is kind of one of the things that I wanted to have you come on because I know that you made it clear for me in, uh, in the phone conversation that we had, uh, about a month ago when- Mm-hmm... 34:13 Spinner was saying, "You know, this bike just doesn't feel right, and this bike feels, uh, like more sturdy than, than the other one." 34:21 And I know that, that, uh, you had shared the fact that now the bike is made for, to take up to hundred and forty or a hundred and sixty millimeter fork, right? Yeah. Uh-huh. And that means that- Mm-hmm... 34:33 that head tube area had to be, uh, had to be stronger to pass testing. Yep. Absolutely. 34:41 Yep, and then the- And that- One thing that I can really tell when you talk about unloading that front wheel, that's something that, um- Mm-hmm... 34:47 you know, that was kind of my experience when I was climbing with the bike. It, it felt a lot different. That wheel, the rear wheels way underneath you. 34:53 And, you know, that was kind of my first thing is like, maybe I'm not riding this bike for what it's meant for, but like you said, maybe it's a preference type of deal. 35:00 So I think we're gonna change some things up, up with it. Um, we're gonna single speed it out. We're gonna, um, you know, change some things on the bike, and then we're gonna take it out again. Yeah. 35:10 You know, and like there's things that would be, would be quick and easy for, you know, with that bike for you to try is that if it's feeling like it's feeling a little squirrely or it's not climbing the way you would, move the wheel all the way back in the dropout. 35:22 Right. I mean, that's twenty, that's twenty mills that's most of the difference, and then see if that's what it is. It might not be that. It might be, um, it might be the tires that are specced. 35:32 It might be, um, it might be the gearing. I mean, these are ridic-ridiculous things, but, you know, I'm trying to kinda- Yeah, they make a difference, and the nice thing is-... single things out... 35:41 like you said, you can-- it is designed that you can slide that tire back. Right. It does have horizontal dropouts, so. 35:45 And that's the other thing that I remember now is that the Nards are so much easier rolling and- Oh my gosh... so much easier to break loose in traction, in cornering- Yeah... 35:56 than you, it's really almost impossible to break the- Yeah... uh, Dirt Wizards loose because they're such- Yeah... a knobby tire. They bite in, yeah. 36:05 That was, that was something that we talked about and I would bring up too, and it's something that I recommend to people, is that the difference between the twenty-nine inch Narf and the twenty-nine inch Dirt Wizard is about as wide a spectrum as you can have. 36:20 Um, one's a pretty light, really fast rolling tire meant for just about anything, and one is an incredibly aggressive tire. I don't know many tires more aggressive than it. 36:31 And, um, so I weigh about a hundred and seventy-five pounds. I'm about six feet tall, and the Krampus is a long bike. And with the Nards, it didn't-- it wasn't getting all around, but you could get the thing turned. 36:45 I could get the thing turned because it could slide it a little bit, especially the back. Sure. Mm-hmm. But Dirt Wiz-- or, uh, with Dirt Wizards, it's so planted that I just... 36:53 I take all my weight and I throw it and the bike just, it doesn't move like I'm used to. 36:58 And I would say, um, for people that are used to the old bike, that's a-- that change, the tires, is a bigger change than geometry in my opinion. Mm-hmm. And so- So we'll have to try that too. Yeah, we're gonna do that. 37:10 Yeah. I've had good luck. Uh, I like a Dirt Wizard up front and a Nar in the back for that bike. Um-'Cause that way I can get the thing turned around and keep, get it going the way I want to. 37:21 But otherwise, you know, like that, it's a massive, massive difference. 37:26 And then it's good because some people are having trouble, you know, as, as the bike with a platform, we had some issues with it in that suspension forks were really hard to get to fit, let alone spec. Impossible. Right. 37:37 And so we had to do these things. These things, forks are now available, but it's like, hey, some people need, they want a 29 plus bike, but they need a heavy, really aggressive tire 'cause they're riding in, you know, 37:49 they're riding in Colorado or they're riding on Utah, and they're like, "Hey man, this bike is cool, but this tire doesn't last more than a little bit, and then, you know, I'm gonna fall down the mountain." 37:58 Um, so we made those tires. Um, and they do their job pretty well, I think. And that should be- And so- That should be Surly's new motto is, we make the most gnarly tire ever. [laughs] 'Cause we're not gonna say that. 38:12 How many- I don't want to claim. How many other tires stay at the top of the gnar chart like Bud and Lou have? Yeah, no kidding. [laughs] Or, or- Um-... 38:21 Dirt Wizard, they're just, you know, they're 11s on the one to 10- Yeah... gnar scale. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It's funny because we-- So we've made three sizes, well, now four of the, of the Gn- or the Dirt Wizard. 38:35 We started out with the 26 with the Instigator, and then we made the 29, then the 27, and now we just re-releasing the 26 by 3. 38:43 The 26 ended up 275 to fit in a suspension fork, but it wasn't as aggressive as we had originally hoped, and then the 29 was more aggressive, and that didn't quite get to where we wanted either. 38:55 And then the, the 27 one became the platform for like... So those three tires, they get more aggressive as they go, and now we just released the 26 by 3.0 Dirt Wizard- Mm-hmm... and it's as aggressive as the 27. 39:07 So, um- 26 plus... yeah, I think it's- Yeah. 26 plus. Yeah. We're talking 26 plus. Um- That no- that nobody talks about, except for me. It's a weird size. [laughs] You know? It's, it's weird. 39:21 Um, uh, but it's, it's, it works. The Instigator was a weird bike. It had foibles, you know, um, but it needs support for people to talk about it. 39:32 It, it needs support, you know, and there needs to be, uh, bikes and frames that work around it. 39:37 As I think that more and more people start riding, I think the 26 plus is a more manageable size, um, for weight and spinning than 27 for anyone under, you know, 5'10", 5'9", 5'8". Mm-hmm. 39:50 So, um, I think there's, I think, is it Giant or one of the companies is making a 26 plus mountain bike, maybe it's Janus. But, uh, it's cool, you know? We'll see where it goes. 39:59 A lot of our stuff's like sometimes it goes nowhere, sometimes it does go somewhere, and you just never know. I don't know. 40:05 Uh, there's a pretty fairly, uh, uh, good track record of you steering the industry towards new stuff so- Mm-hmm... um, you know, I can't wait to- Well-... see what you guys come out with next. 40:17 I know you probably can't talk about it, but, you know. No, but- Mm-hmm... I mean, as a general rule, we're an opinionated bunch. Uh, like, you know, it's important to say that I speak for myself, you know? 40:28 Um, but there's a lot of opinions and there's a lot of passion. 40:31 And so we, instead of saying progressive geometry, we, we do, like one thing I do take a lot of pride in is that we do mess around with stuff and we do see does this work better, and sometimes it works better and sometimes it doesn't, and it's sometimes we find something that legitimately works better. 40:47 Like this fucking rules, but I don't know if anybody's gonna understand or dig it. And even just talking about it sometimes can be kind of la- laborious because it's like it's such nerd speak. 40:57 It's so- so much lingo that it's just- [laughs]... tiring. You're like, ah. A lot of math. You know, it doesn't really matter, and it's a struggle, and you're like, okay, no, this is, this is legit. 41:06 This is-- We just gotta figure out a way to, you know, make it and made. And so, you know. In, in, in the end, the cleansing, the cleansing of, of a good ride after nerd talk is always a good idea. 41:17 [laughs] That's what, uh, that's what we personally- You know, and, you know, this is a bike show and we talk bike lingo and stuff. 41:23 Man, sometimes it just gets to be a lot and be like, you know, let's talk about something else. It's just nice. Mm-hmm. Thank you. You're bringing it back. You're getting bored over there. I'm gonna say I- Well [laughs] 41:34 Well, for, well, for me, it's like, you know, bike people are cool, but bike people are kind of weird, and they're socially awkward. They definitely are. 41:39 There's something that they've got and they can all talk about, but sometimes it's a bummer because there's newer riders there or riders that don't know the lingo, and all of a sudden they're just like, "Can I still be on this ride? 41:50 I don't know about-" [laughs] "... I don't know what a clutch is. I don't, I don't know what tubeless is. I just kind of came out to ride." I think that's engineering speak, too. Yep. It's a little bit- Yeah... 42:00 beyond us. Before tonight, I didn't know what compassionate touch was. [laughs] You poor, poor man. [laughs] I'm just gonna stop on the trail and hope somebody else comes up- [laughs] All right. See- Yeah... 42:14 I think, I think Leah- We're good... Leah might be the, the, the trail wizard or the dirt wizard, and I might be the nard. We [laughs] we might be the op- There you go... 42:24 180 degrees different on how we ride, but- Mm-hmm. Oh, the, the last time we were in here, I'm thinking, God, do people even really listen to this show? And then after the show, 42:34 Gomez and Spinner are sitting there talking about some bike parts for about 20 minutes. Yeah, the- I'm like, "Y'all, it's time to go. I'm closing shop." 42:43 [laughs] And I'm like, definitely these guys- No, you're just great... are listening to this show. [laughs] Every group- Yeah... ride I go on- I can't believe it... these guys. [laughs] I w- I do want to bring it back. 42:51 The, you were talking about the cool things that you do in Try it. Um, I have the, the big fat dummy and I really enjoy that bike, and we rode the shit out of that thing this l- [laughs] last weekend- Yeah... 43:01 over in Michigan, so. Well, that was- You had some sweet pics. That was one of the weird ones. 43:05 You know, I, I, that, to be honest, that, that project was amazing 'cause I really loved the design, but I was like, "God, I, I can't wait to get rid of this thing as soon as I get one because I don't wanna ride this fucking thing. 43:16 It's ridiculous." [laughs] But we got them and it was actually amazing. I was like, wow. That rides, uh, yeahI wanted that bike ever since I got a regular Big Dummy. 43:24 I was waiting for the Big Fat Dummy and I've-- And yeah, I-- we use the shit out of it. It does what it's supposed to do. It, uh, I mountain bike with it. I take it on trails. It's, uh, I love that bike. Yeah. 43:35 We just did a big bike- Yeah... bike tour with two fat cargo bikes, three fat bikes with hacked trailers. We rode it in the lake, we rode it in the sand, [laughs] we rode it- Yeah... in the woods. 43:47 We, we rode the piss out of that thing- Yeah... sometimes. That rules. 43:52 And, you know, like, I'd say I do speak for the group and, like, nothing makes anyone in the, in the team, like, more stoked than when people just take stuff and, like, use it or make it their own. 44:02 Like, it's, it's kind of-- We always hope it's like some sort of stepping off platform of, like, empowerment of, like, you know, maybe you don't need this whole thing, but you just need that, then you can do your thing, and then you find your spot. 44:14 You know, like, really hesitant to ever tell anyone what to do. [laughs] Mm-hmm. 'Cause just that usually sucks. I don't think-- I think we need less people telling people what to do. 44:23 Um- Yeah, that's a, that's a- But are we diverging? That's like the new Surly jingle, what you just said right there. [laughs] If you don't like our shit, don't ride it. I don't care. [laughs] Don't buy our shit. 44:37 [laughs] Um, um, so what is, uh-- Give me another question 'cause I feel like I'm mumbling. Well- What's going on?... 44:44 I think that we've actually-- I've, I've gotten to the bottom of everything that I wanted to talk about. How about you, Spinner? Okay. You got any other questions about that Krampus? No, I don't think so. 44:54 I think it, uh, it makes a lot of sense. We-- I've noticed that, like I said, you can get that front wheel off the ground. 44:58 Uh, and the climbing that I've been doing with it, I had a hard time keeping the wheel on the ground. But I am gonna try that different thing. 45:03 I'm gonna slide the wheel back, and I'm gonna single speed it out and put different tires on. I'm gonna make it- I think your world's gonna change when you- Yeah... are standing and climbing as well. 45:11 Oh, I think the pr- the problem was, is I had the old Krampus, and I expected this to ride the same, and it doesn't. It doesn't. 45:16 And then once it, like-- I was like, "This is not the same at all," so then I had to change my mindset. Mm-hmm. So. Yeah. 45:23 And like, like I said, I'd say, and I'll venture to guess, I'm not 100% sure, but the spec is a big change. And so- Right... um, like, do little things. 45:33 Like if you're, if you-- So one, I am a huge fan of the original Krampus. Like, there's something that just was right. I didn't design it. Adam at Thor designed it. Mm. 45:42 And, like, it's just this beautiful system, and it just works. I can't really explain it. I did-- I was a huge skeptic of that bike, too. I was like, "Damn, this thing's so sweet." 45:50 Uh, and the new one is a little different, but, like, it could be something as simple as it has a 30.9 seatpost that might be stiffer than you're used to. Like- Mm-hmm... come back to spec. And, like, 46:00 I wrote a blog where I actually did put all my old parts on my new frame with some spacers and adapters and all my, all that stuff. You can always get back to square one. 46:08 And then it did ride different with all my old parts, you know? Mm. So think about that. Um, think about drivetrains, think about handlebars, think about all those things. 46:17 And then, like, I'd say, like, if you wanna make that change, like, make sure you're running a dropper on it. Like, it's, it i- those things do do a thing, you know? And then the-- it's pretty amazing. 46:27 And when you start to get the seat out of the way and figure out your front to back balance, all of a sudden a lot of things, a lot of new trail features start to make sense and, um, kind of expand where you can go and, and do. 46:39 So I mean, if you got the new frame, I'd say, like, maximize it. Put a dropper on there. Um- You too can have-- You too can be a progressive mountain biker. [laughs] Yeah. I was like, yeah, I'm not progressive. 46:51 Like- Maybe. I don't know. It's the- I'm not gonna say that. [laughs] No, I just said that. Yeah, Gomer's gonna say it. I'm, I'm looking right at Spinner. [laughs] Get with it. [laughs] Yeah. No. Yeah. 47:02 No, I mean, I like a lot of the bikes. You know, and also something- I'm just-... also something you said that if you're really happy with the old Krampus, fucking keep it, man. Like- Oh, I'm keeping it... keep it. 47:11 It's an amazing bike. [laughs] Oh, yeah. It doesn't make you a, it doesn't make you a stalwart or a holdout- No... if it makes you happy. Like, fuck, man. I don't think I've ever sold a Surly. I got a, I got a stable. 47:21 [laughs] Yeah, he does. Yeah. Well, thanks for, uh, coming on the show, Andy. I know that, uh, everyone that buys a Surly probably gets to talk to you like this, right? You get calls all the time. Yeah. Yeah. 47:34 I, you know, it starts to get in my way, but I get really lonely, so I just, I keep answering calls. [laughs] All right, dude, thanks for coming on the show. Yeah. And, uh, we will catch you on the flip side. 47:45 Say hello to all of our, uh, all of our friends up there. Oh, I will. Nice talking with y'all. All right. That was Andy Skoglund from Surly. And we are gonna go to a break, and when we come back, [laughs] 48:00 it's Spinner versus Leia. [laughs] But she hasn't accepted yet. Oh, please. [laughs] Bitch, please. [laughs] Remember, I don't stop on the trail. Yeah. Okay. 48:17 [laughs] You crash, though. That's g- [laughs] All right. I don't wanna say I'm gonna be crossing my fingers hoping for a crash. [laughs] Oh, man. Are we recording? It's getting dirty now. [laughs] Hey, we're back. 48:28 Wait, wait. What, what was the name of that, that bike that you had that you went traveling around all weekend long? The Big Fat Dummy. There's no way a Big Fat Dummy is taking out the Ice Queen. I'm sorry. 48:38 Oh, we're not going Big Fat Dummy in this one. Not gonna happen. I'm gonna bring out my lightning fast White Lightning single speed Pugsley. [laughs] Yes. We, we've, we've wandered right into the special segment. 48:51 Uh, last week- Leia was talking shit on break. [laughs] So after, after our last show, after w- show number 128, Spinner took me to... What was the name of that place? Off Broadway. Off Broadway. 49:05 It's just Off Broadway, yeah. There you go. Mm-hmm. That's-- I got the name right. And, uh, we, we stopped for some dinner and some refreshments. 49:11 Once again, Leia was too busy to join us 'cause I know she was just about to say, "What? What? What? What?" You can come with. You can come with. 49:21 Yeah, so she- I can't do the bike geek speak for more thanSeven minutes is probably my threshold [laughs] See, there you go. She was, she was ready to be rid of us. But- [laughs] Yeah... 49:31 my point here is that four- 4.35 beers into- [laughs]... that conversation- Oh, yeah... Spinner threw down the gauntlet. He's like, "Ah, I'm- That was your idea... 49:42 I'm, I'm gonna let Spinner explain his- I don't know [laughs]... his challenge. Yeah. How did this come about? I don't know if it was exactly my idea, but I do have a history- I know it was Gomez instigating... 49:50 of saying shit like that. Well, we'll see. We'll, we'll kinda talk through it here. But I have a history of challenging, uh, fast people with light bikes to, uh, I don't know, challenges, just extreme challenges. 50:04 So, um, I, you know, we've raced together before. Never, I didn't- I wouldn't call that racing together. Well, maybe we say, yeah, we've raced in the same race. You saw me as I was lapping you. No. Oh. You saw me go by. 50:17 I don't think you did. I don't think you did. I don't think I got la- uh, did you lap me on the Big Fat Dummy? I don't know. I don't know. You know what? 50:24 Maybe we should look back and, uh, and next episode we'll pull up your times for the first- Oh... Fat Bike Birkie. You know what? I have them right here. Oh, dang it. [laughs] I've already looked this up. Oh, dude. 50:38 'Cause it, yeah, we sent it out, so- The fat fact check on us... yeah, I can't remember. I was gonna... I brought the bike. I was gonna ride something else, and I end, I ended up just riding my single speed Pugsley. 50:48 In 2016, the Ice Queen finished at 2:13:16. No, no, no. 2017 is the year that I took you. Right. Yeah. Right, but, but there was- That's this year. But you're looking up the first year. Because you know why? 51:03 The first time. Because I was riding a cargo bike full of beer. [laughs] Yeah, just... Did you have stud tires? Yeah, well we all- I did not have stud tires... got excuses. Okay. Yeah, we're starting now. You know? 51:11 We're talking 2017. You want me to start dipping into my pocket for all my excuses in 2016? [laughs] Oh, this is- Okay. No, you better keep them ready. You're gonna need them in 2018. 51:20 [laughs] So yeah, 2016, so this is the first one. This is the one I looked up. You finished at two hours, 13 minutes, 16 seconds on what? Your carbon Salsa? Yes. Did it have disc brakes? [laughs] On there somewhere. Yes. 51:37 [laughs] Few things. Please God, let there be disc brakes. And my finish, my time, uh, was 2:26, so 10 minutes after. 10 minutes difference, that's, that's- No, 13. And I was working with one leg at the time. Oh, yeah? 51:49 [laughs] I was fucking drunk- [laughs]... [laughs] riding a single speed in a- So-... in a bike and a skirt and fur. So the challenge is Spinner versus Leia in the 2018 Fat Bike Birkie. 52:05 Leia on her super light- 23 pounds- 23... Salsa Bear Grease, all carbon with the Hed wheels. Hed wheels. Mm-hmm. Gonna go with 27.5 Hed wheels this year. Oh, yeah. George is hooking me up with the 27.5s. 52:19 So the newest- Yeah... technology America can make through China. [laughs] Come on. Versus- Uh... Spinner riding a single speed. The drunk Viking. [laughs] Mm. Right, the drunk Vi- Viking versus the Ice Queen. 52:36 On his 86 pound steel bike. [laughs] Mm-hmm. 30, 33 pounds. To say, the night before, I closed down the sawmill, and I was the first guy in there having a bloody Mary the next morning. 52:44 [laughs] Man, that place is so fun after the race. Isn't it? God, that's what I look forward to the whole time. Yeah. Yeah. And you get paid. Well, so maybe- I just have to pay for beer when I get there. 52:53 Yeah, so maybe what, what's, what's the wager here? Have you figured that out, like, uh- A huge $1,500 check. Oh. [laughs] I'm not doing that. Yeah. [laughs] I'm not doing that. Just get, get your wallet out. 53:05 [laughs] 'Cause I will train day and night. Oh, my God. I can make one of those. I mean, uh, I'm not saying that there's any money in the bank. For every beer you guzzle, I will be biking a mile. Oh. [laughs] Okay. 53:15 'Cause I'm, I'm gonna, like, play the, uh, the odds maker here, and I would say in this, in this, uh, in this challenge, just from here, I have to say Leia is not the underdog here. No. [laughs] Thanks. 53:32 Spinner, you're, you're, you're my, you're my- I got a lot to win... you're my boy blue, but, uh- Yeah. The pressure's really on now. I would actually bet on you. 53:40 [laughs] Leia actually, you know, like, I, I bet you the last time she had a full strength beer was probably, I don't know, a long time ago. She's probably on that, like, Michelob Ultra crap. Oh, yeah. Oh, no, no, no. 53:53 I, you know, I'm a New Glarus girl. All right. Okay. So totally Naked or- If I, yeah... do they have- If I'm gonna drink a beer, it's- The Fat Squirrel... it's gonna be nice and thick. Two Women, Spotted Cow. No. 54:05 Yeah, I haven't had a full s- strength beer since, like, 6:00 this morning. [laughs] I'm, I'm drying out. 54:13 [laughs] So, uh, that's, we'll, we'll, we'll retouch on, on this, uh, see how training is going throu- We should throw a vote out there. I mean- Oh. Yeah. A vote? Yeah. 54:24 You get, yeah, you, you know, you do a little survey or whatnot and see who- Where you, where you, did you see the picture? Yeah, who, who's gonna win this thing. Oh, yeah, I'm gonna put pictures out there. 54:31 Where do you... Where's your... Yeah, you need a picture of you doing that. Well, there's, there's gonna be a, a picture of- Did you see this?... of all three of us- Did you see that?... 54:37 behind the, behind the giant- That's, that's what I'm talking about right there. [laughs] That's... But you- Yeah, so get that picture against me instead of this random jokester. Instead of that dude. Yeah. Don't worry. 54:49 We will, we'll, the billboards are going up on I-94. [laughs] Right now. Play on. The challenge. The Ice Queen- Here we go... versus Spinner. The, the oldest technology there is. I think my front wheel weighs 23 pounds. 55:03 I do think I should put some vodka in my- You don't do that?... uh, water bottle 'cause, uh, it did freeze. Yeah. No, I'll put vodka in there. I have no water. Put like a- Yeah... 55:13 like a quarter vodka for what you got in there. I think I'm gonna do that this year. That's the trick, everybody. You don't do... I thought everybody did that. I'm not even kidding. 55:19 Tip of the day, vodka in your water bottle. I'm not even trying to be alcoholic, but that's how you keep that from freezing. Yeah. [laughs] Right? Yeah. So- Dude, you are so doomed. She's just, she's just [laughs] 55:28 she's just messing with you. Mm-hmm. You're gonna have vodka in your, her water, your water, and she's gonna have, like, Underdog super vitamin energy pills or something. Yeah. Yep. I'm gonna get chicked.Yeah. 55:40 Oh, yeah Oh. And you're gonna like it. [laughs] Well, and see, the thing is, is she's gonna get a preferred start, 'cause she did win the, uh, whole race last year. Uh-huh. 55:50 Uh, so, you know, you're gonna have- What the fuck am I doing? [laughs] You got some ground to make up, my friend. Yeah, I do. You're gonna have to, uh, drop all, all polite decorum and- Well-... be like, "Race leader!" 56:03 She, uh, she crashes a lot. I have a chance. I have a fighting chance. [laughs] You do have a fighting chance. So it's like, uh- Have you crashed on that track? I'm either gonna- On that course?... win or crash out. 56:12 Okay. [laughs] Well, that's- All right, I'm gonna- That's my only option... so th- that's still a win or lose, just so you know. I'm afraid for you both. If you crash and can't finish- I crashed at the last Birkie. 56:22 Did you? Oh, yeah. Bad? And still won. It hurt. [laughs] My hip hurt. Ooh. It's ice. Dang it, that's hard. Oh, that's right. There's no- Everybody crashed... no grace. Yeah, everyone went down at least once. I did not. 56:32 Big fat dummy did not. Well, you know- It's 'cause you weren't biking. All I can say is- [laughs] You were sitting on the side of the course drinking your beers. [laughs] I saw that. With a hand up. As they were, yeah. 56:43 It was something like six laps. I'd, I'd saw you go by a bunch of times. I know. Well, yeah, yeah. 56:49 And then, like, I had to put beer back there because [laughs] I need to wait on that wheel, and then as I got tired, I had to drink that beer, so. Yeah. Um, it was highlight. 56:57 Actually, uh, it, uh, it was freezing up a little bit. It was cool. I know that I'm gonna be just- Did you have studded tires? I'm gonna be so- Oh, yeah... proud of both of you after that. He has studded. 57:05 Even with those. Even with- Just sliding away. Yeah. I was not studded. All right. Well, I think that's it for this week's show. I hope you enjoyed it. Wow. Woo. We had lots of banter, et cetera. 57:19 Our show this evening has been brought to you by the bike sparks and chaos of Surly Bikes. Learn more at surlybikes.com. [gasps] And check us out on Instagram at fatbike.com. Till then, sweet dreams, bitches. 57:35 [outro music] Remember to subscribe to Fatbike Podcast Reviews
